Suzy

Hola, I'm Suzy and welcome to the Wander World School and Slow Family Travel Podcast, where we discuss the stories, logistics and finances of traveling families and the multitude of ways to learn and educate along the way. Today, I'm joined by Maggie Tucker.

Maggie is an early retiree and co-host of the Inside Out Money personal finance podcast. On this conversation, we discuss Maggie's journey to early retirement after 20 years in a corporate job, her blended family's approach to travel with three teenage daughters, and the logistics and costs of their trips, including a six-week European adventure. Maggie emphasizes that early retirement provides the time and financial flexibility but is sometimes tricky with busy teenagers, yet she values travel as one of the many ways to raise well-adjusted children.

Suzy

Welcome. Please tell me more about you and your family.

Maggie Tucker

Hi, thank you so much for having me. I live in Atlanta, Georgia. And I am married to my husband, Greg. We've been married about seven years And we have a blended family of three girls that are 13, 14 and 17.

Suzy

That's great. they're close in age. Did they all get along? mean, yes, okay.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah, they actually all get along pretty well. Yeah, I mean, at these ages now, they all have very separate lives. that's actually one of the things I love about when we travel, they're like thick as thieves. They're back in it together like when they were little kids and like when it was COVID days and they were all wrapped in the house together for years.

Suzy

Uh huh. Like just with each I have two boys and of course every, every child is different, but there's benefits. have very similar interests. So I wonder, does that manifest in your kids that there's like some overlap with just like girls, especially when they travel, it's just easier to have similar interests or talk about things.

Maggie Tucker

Definitely. Yeah.

Yeah, totally. They're into the same music. they're all into the same stuff. They dress the same way. They borrow each other's clothes or do in each other's hair. I have an older brother. we were just not really like interested in the same stuff when we were traveling. We were not we did not have the kind of relationship that my girls have, even the fact that they sometimes spend time at other houses, it's cute. and they've all known each other since they were two and five. So they've kind of grown up together, which is nice too.

Suzy

wow.

That is so cool to have that relationship. Yeah, I had a brother too. We're definitely close still now, but maybe it's just a little different. I always wonder what it be like to have a sister. So I'm happy that my kids have each other ⁓ And then you are currently early retired, which I really want to dive into a little bit more here because my audience is traveling families. They want to travel more. So there's always this balance of time, money and things like that.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah, it's cool.

Yeah.

Suzy

And so I love to bring in some of your personal finance expertise, your journey to this. I've been listening to your personal finance podcast since you were, with your prior co-host Mike on the friends on fire, which was a great podcast. Plus also hear more of your journey as it was unfolding. Yes.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah, who's in real time, yeah.

Suzy

Yes.

And now you host Inside Out Money with rotating co-hosts. First, before we jump into the money and the travel, I'm curious what the most fun thing is for you about your podcasting journey.

Maggie Tucker

I've now been doing it for about three years since being early retired. the best thing is in an early retired world where I left a very all consuming career and job, it's something that gives me purpose in a community.

It's a great avenue to meet like-minded people. it's also super rewarding. the reason I do it for free and there's no ads and I don't make any money from it is I just want to put something cool out there that's a great resource, the kind of resource I wish I had had when I was younger. And it is also super rewarding. when I get a review, like a podcast review, a written review, or just a note from somebody, like when I got your note and you were like, I've been listening from the beginning and I really enjoy it, that makes me happy in a much actually a more meaningful way than when I was at work.

Suzy

I think this is good for families that are maybe traveling more, leaving the comfort of a home base. And then they're going out to the unknown, kind of like when someone early retires, just how to keep up with those passions that you have, the connections that you have, ways to, build more of a community. And I agree, those are all the reasons I've really enjoyed podcasting. It was a three year goal of mine, but working full time, we're on like the COASFY plan.

I work part-time, we're in Spain So it gives me a passion and an interest. And I just love the medium of podcasting where I can listen to other people's wisdom on my schedule we're all busy families. And then you build this connection with someone. at FinCon, was saying hi to people. like, I've heard your voice for years and you have no idea who I am. So it's an interesting medium in that regard. Thank you for sharing.

Maggie Tucker

at your leisure, yeah.

Suzy

And before we talk about your family travels, I'd love to understand more about some of your personal travel origin story, and how that shaped some of your philosophies as a family that travels.

Maggie Tucker

so I did not travel much as a kid. I never went out of the country until I was 28, which I'll get back to in a minute. Our family vacations every year, almost every single year.

where we would get on a plane, which felt like a very big deal to us. I remember my mom would like drive to the physical Delta office in Atlanta where you had to buy the tickets before you could buy them online. we would fly to New Jersey every year from Atlanta. we would go to Ocean City, New Jersey. I have incredibly fond memories. because we had just a lot of freedom, right?

I have a bunch of cousins all around similar ages, too many boys, but some girls also. But I have like awesome memories of every summer in Ocean City, New Jersey, I was just never exposed to international travel as a kid.

when I was 28 and in grad school. I was doing my part-time MBA and I just wanted to get through it faster. And one of the ways was to take a two week class in Buenos Aires, Argentina. And so I did it for that. And it was cool.

right around the same time, started working for IHG, a big travel company. And so I got to travel internationally as part of that. even just working for an international company and starting to work with people from other countries I definitely was exposed to it more. And it's interesting, that probably had a bigger... impact than even like my first international trip, I think I got the travel bug when I was working for IHG, which I've never fully appreciated until you asked that, but.

Suzy

That's great. mean, everyone comes to it from a different, different history, different story.

so now you've been to a couple of different countries, your kids have traveled to different countries. I'm curious, you didn't travel a ton growing up and then now offering that perspective to your kids, I wonder how our kids are gonna think differently.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

Suzy

as their adults having had more travel experiences younger, because I think that is more common that more kids have had travel experiences than their parents. my kids have already, I mean, by age four and six, they were living in a different country. I'm really curious to see where this unfolds in the future. Not that we can predict it,

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

you know, it's interesting. would imagine a lot of your listeners have goals to travel or are already traveling. But I will say, you know, like, I'm fine, right? I never traveled as a kid and I was fine. I was, I think, a pretty like empathetic, well-developed, you know, I'm not sure if I could call myself like cultured, but I was fine, right? I was launched in the same way that...

I want my kids to launch themselves. it's a nice to have thing and it is a luxury and a privilege in so many ways I've now been to 22 countries. I had to go add it up for this actually, it was kind of fun. Since I was 28, I'm 45 now. And my kids have been to 12 countries I feel very privileged to be able to give them that experience. But at the same time, I think they would still be good people and fine citizens and productive humans, which is what I want for them, without that. two things can be true, right? So it's like, don't feel bad if you can't give your kids that, but also it's a really cool thing, right?

Suzy

Yes,

that is a really, good point comparison is a thief of joy is a phrase I tell myself a lot. If you get into a world where you're like, I want inspiration from other families that are traveling, before you know it, you're maybe seeing other people are doing stuff that may be entertainable for you from a logistical, a time, a financial standpoint. And that's where it's important to say like,

Maggie Tucker

Yes.

Suzy

that would be great, but it's not essential to my family's wellbeing to have that exact experience. We can replicate something similar that is approachable for us in a different way that we could still learn and grow from. And yes, our kids will learn to be productive, amazing adults from not just a trip or two or three, but from our daily interactions with them and their community and so many other factors.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

Yes.

And if anything, sometimes I'm trying to like check my kids because when we travel, sometimes they'll have certain expectations. I'm like, slow down. You are not paying for this. They'll will be in like we'll go into an Airbnb and they're like, we're going to take this room. And I was like, no, you are not. Greg and I will be in this room. Let me take you to your quarters. And they like, give me a hard time. Like, well, there's more of us. And I'm like, yeah, guess who's paying for this?

I they lead a very nice life. Be, to be clear, they all have like beds to sleep in, you know what I mean? they're kids, they ask for everything, you know, and yeah, I have to put

Suzy

Yes.

Maggie Tucker

boundaries and limits on them, which I think is a very important thing to do, even if I can afford to give them anything in the world. I don't actually want to because I don't think it will raise the type of humans I'm trying to raise.

Suzy

since my kids are a little younger, I don't know if they grasp the full financial aspect of it. But I think about that a lot. ⁓ this last trip, we basically gave them like a set amount of money and they could earn a little bit more if they took photos that I wanted them to take because they don't really like that. And I want the photos.

Maggie Tucker

⁓ that's a great, yeah, my kids do not, yeah.

Suzy

And then I'm like, okay, you can earn a little more by photos. And then we would keep track of like what they had. And I made the mistake on a trip in April where I started them with a higher amount and then they earned more. So this time I started them really low. They earned a little more. They got to spend and it does provide opportunities to talk about why we're staying at this location that is close to where we want to be. But yeah, it's tiny. And this is because we're trying to offset things. My son.

Maggie Tucker

You gotta build up.

Yeah.

Suzy

met, we did a trip this summer and he met a friend there and he's like, yeah, we're going to go back to Albania next summer and see Nikkei. I was like, there's a lot that would go into that. We're not just going to go to see your friend. So you're right. It's this balance of, want to open your world and also I want to make sure that you are grounded. Yeah. Practicing gratitude. Exactly.

Maggie Tucker

Ha

Ground it? I want you to realize how expensive it is for me to open your world, you know, and that not everyone can open their world and it costs money to open your world and yeah.

Suzy

Yes,

exactly. And not to maybe expect that everyone you meet has had these same opportunities. And that if you want to continue with this interest that you'll have to maybe take on some of this as you're an adult. So yes, ⁓

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

we do trip budgets with our kids too and it's worked out really well. I love the concept of giving more for photos. Do you pay like per photo? What's your system?

Suzy

So that's funny. They will think it's like per photo, but it's by that moment, I'll pay you a euro. Cause sometimes they're making goofy faces and I take like 20. ⁓ so I'm like, no, that was not 20 euros. So it's by experience. And this is like somewhat over a shorter trip. So it probably ends up being once or twice a day. Yeah.

Maggie Tucker

Okay.

Okay.

Okay.

So it's very ad hoc. Like when you're trying to take a photo, you just throw out like, I'll give you a euro if you take a good photo.

Suzy

Yes, sometimes

they're down for it. Like they don't realize this could be a money making opportunity. They'll take it. And this is kind of ones where I have them pose or smile. they're always on the go. So half my photos are them running away from me because they're in the moment and those are fine too. But if it's like, this is a moment that I would like us to remember, let's take a photo. Here's a Euro dollar, wherever the currency is. And I feel like that's a trade off that

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

Yeah.

Suzy

gets me what I want, gets them a little bit more spending money, which they're inevitably gonna ask for little things anyhow. And then they get that day to day okay, this costs this much here. And so if I buy this now, will I have anything later for a treat? you gotta start small when they're littler because eventually it'll be bigger dollars, bigger budgets.

Maggie Tucker

I love watching them discuss and debate you see their different habits with how they spend money. One of them's like waiting till the very end because she really wants to like weigh her options. And one of them's like burning all their money up front. they very thoughtfully and intentionally do, think about how they want to use that budget.

Suzy

we definitely have attempted different like budgets and different things with the kids during the week. but sometimes that falls to the wayside or there's not a great way to keep track. I think as they end up with their own debit and credit cards, it may be easier.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

Suzy

I feel like traveling gives you this set timeframe and there's so many opportunities to spend money you find walking around places. So it really gives us concentrated opportunities to have these conversations.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

Yeah.

a great, yeah, that's a great point. Cause we've been surprisingly inconsistent for someone who hosts a personal finance podcast with our kids. we try different chore systems and allowances and we, they, and part of it's just that the kids lose interest too. when we're tri, on, on trips, it's a much more like finite window and it works very, very well there.

Suzy

X, yeah.

Maggie Tucker

does not work very, well in our day-to-day house.

Suzy

Yes.

Well, thank you for validating that because we've struggled a little bit with with trying to come up with a system. speaking of those family trips, I know from listening to your podcast and different things, you have taken more summer focus. You have taken some longer trips. Is there any particular trip that comes to mind that you'd like to share more about,

Maggie Tucker

the longest trip we've ever done is a six week trip that we did the summer when we early retired. So it was the summer of twenty twenty two. we did it to kind of celebrate our early retirement. Greg and I both left 20 years at corporate jobs and we're just like, we want to go all out this summer. reminder we have a blended family. So

Suzy

years ago.

Maggie Tucker

I cannot just take them off and travel for two months during the school year What we can do is get these longer trips in the summer. And most summers we do a two to three week trip with them. This particular summer I had asked, well over a year in advance, I had asked our exes, like, how would you feel about a six week trip? It was also a really cool experience that, you we were bankrolling. And so we did six weeks, six countries in Europe. I think the biggest thing that was too long was we were moving every one to three nights.

And that's one of our biggest learnings is like, is exhausting, not just to like pack yourself up, but to get the kids to pack up and everything else. they were like eight, nine and 12 that summer. And it was a fun trip. It was a great age to be traveling with them. They did awesome.

But it was just a lot. They were just tired of being nomadic. We have so many memories. We always talk about it and we got to see, a ton of stuff that summer. And I think they thought it was a pretty cool experience.

Suzy

And you bring up a lot of really good points how blended families have a lot of other considerations and then also the balance of we finally have time off. I can only imagine how exciting that was for you after a long career. And now we have this time off and wanting to fit as much in as possible. And then some of the afterthoughts of that is, OK, that was a little fast,

Maggie Tucker

Yeah, that was cool.

Suzy

If I ask this, I don't want to sound like maybe you regret any part of that, but if you were to do a six week chunk again, how would you mix it up? I'm just curious based on that, those learning lessons from that trip.

Maggie Tucker

That's a good question.

Honestly, we've taken those learnings even into our two to three week trips. we just go to fewer places, right? We try to jam less in. And I am a big fan of not trying to do everything and see everything in a city. I will either come back or I won't. And like, it'll be okay.

we do big cities. We're often, flying in and out of them, but I prefer like small to medium sized cities and smaller towns. prefer a town where like, I feel comfortable letting my kids, walk down the street into town, which I can't do in London I think our biggest thing is just, we, we try not to see it all. And we, try not to move like three to four nights as our minimum now.

Suzy

it makes a huge difference to just enjoying that time soaking in wherever you are, local culture. And what have your kids said about your travels?

Maggie Tucker

They really enjoy ice cream and desserts. They love treats. They like cool places. we stay in a lot of Airbnb's now. I used to work for a hotel company. When I had that discount, we stayed in a lot of hotels, but I don't have that discount anymore. And with three kids that are basically like adult size, it's hard to do hotels for us.

it's just easier and more enjoyable to be in an Airbnb and have a kitchen and everything else. I love like a cool place, like just a unique place, an eclectic place, like neat design. And they do too. So I love the like wow factor when we walk into a new place and they're like, ⁓ this is cool. And they're kind of like, they're excited about where they're going to sleep I think they're excited at the prospect of, visiting new places.

Suzy

since you did work in the hotel industry and I have wondered this question hotels seem to really target couples, single people, and maybe like young kids, cause there'll be like a second bed, but or short trips because you don't mind maybe sharing a space for one or two nights. And then as soon as you want like a separate bedroom or just a little more space, or anything that will at least fit a family of four or five. Now it's just so expensive because it's a suite and you don't need this fancy suite. I just wonder, cause hotels have the benefit of like a 24 hour check-in. Sometimes the pools are really nice, the free breakfast, but it seems like there's a gap there where they could have more like tiny apartments in a hotel.

Suzy

I just have not experienced that. And Europe is even more strict with like the number of people in there. Exactly. And I don't always like to like split rooms. And I just feel like there's like a gap there where maybe the hotel industry actually could target families, but maybe we're not the ones that spend a lot of money.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah, you can't sneak extra PBA.

Yeah.

I mean, no, families spend a lot of money, mean, hotels have adjoining rooms. It's hard to guarantee adjoining rooms. but it's super complicated.

Suzy

that's true.

Maggie Tucker

I remember one year when we traveled and our kids are younger but I remember telling my kids, it was not an adjoining room. They were like across the hall. I like taught them how to call us on the phone. And I was like, the one rule is you may not leave this room. That lasted like four minutes. I hear a knock on my door.

And yeah, so I was always like very uncomfortable. Now my kids are older, I wouldn't really care. But it's just by the time I booked two rooms, it's the same price and I'm more comfortable in an Airbnb. to your point, it is a bit of a gap. There are hotels that are designed more for families they have suites that are much, more affordable.

Suzy

Maggie Tucker

I mean, the gap is a lot of hotels are in partnership with Airbnb, VRBO and other sort of vacation rental type companies. ⁓ there's a time when it is much more attractive to stay there versus like, I actually like staying in hotels when it's just Greg and I.

Suzy

Yes.

Oh, absolutely. We just did a trip to a wedding. and we stayed at like a sauna hotel and like the Hyatt right by the airport was really nice. Like you walk to a great restaurant. And I was like, neither of these situations would have worked with our kids. it feels like there could be a gap. Like we actually stayed at a very family friendly hotel in Switzerland. I mean, it had a two story play area.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

Suzy

and an amazing breakfast and it was not cheap, but we had to get two rooms and they weren't even adjoining, but they were next to each other. but I was like, I didn't need like two bathrooms for the four of us. if you would just put like a bunk bed for kids, like around the corner with a wall. But by the time,

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

Yeah.

Suzy

kids in their ages and stages, grow and change. And so then you are okay with something else in a couple of years, it just changes. I'd like to understand a little bit more about the financial and logistical side of planning a trip, because people come at it from different angles. And some people are like, I wanna travel on the lowest budget ever because I wanna travel longer And then I mean, from your six week adventure, that sounded like an opportunity to really, like you said, we're celebrating this big.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

Yeah, we were like, we're splurging, yeah.

Suzy

or splurging,

and I think there's value and excitement for all different types of travel. what are some tips and tricks that you've experienced with the planning, the funding, and the logistical side of your travels?

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

So we are not what I would say budget travelers, but we're also not like balling out, right? So we save money in some areas and we kind of splurge in others. We tend to try our best because we're normally traveling during peak seasons, But, you when we're traveling over the summer, we normally have like literally a two to three week period.

it's hard to get great deals and be like super flexible. What we are a little bit more flexible is with where we'll go. So we are trying to, most of our summer trips, we are getting 70, percent to 100 % of the tickets on miles So we're saving money on the tickets. And then because we're doing Airbnbs and not hotels normally, we're just paying for those. Sometimes I'll be in a city and I'm like, this place looks really cool. And we'll kind of splurge a little bit.

now that the kids are older, we'll involve them in where we're going. So last summer, we will ask everybody for their like top five places they want to go to. And we will keep an eye on tickets. And then one day, all of a sudden, we saw a really good deal to Iceland. when they came home from school one day and we're like, oh, we booked Iceland. That was a really good deal.

Turns out was a good deal because Iceland's incredibly expensive, which I overlooked. But anyways, it was a fun trip. Yeah. Yeah. You're stuck and you're hungry. And food's expensive. I was shocked by the cost of food in Iceland. The good news is when I got home, I was like, man, food's so cheap here. ⁓ But we tried to save on the airfare. ⁓

Suzy

They're happy to get you there because they know. Yes. And those hot dogs are expensive.

Yeah, there you go. That can offer that perspective.

Maggie Tucker

also on food, like we do a mix, you we don't eat out like big fancy meals. But we do buy a lot of like treats out. And we cook in our Airbnbs a lot and we don't eat out like every day when we're traveling.

so I'd say we're kind of like in the middle. We are not luxury travelers, we are not budget travelers. And we also have three kids, so just five people gets expensive.

Suzy

Yeah, that's great.

Yes, and growing kids too. I think it changes over time. ⁓

Maggie Tucker

Yes. Yeah, like we used to be able to pile everybody into a one or two bedroom place. That's even getting tight.

Suzy

pros and cons. They get to carry their own luggage and their own bags, but they take up more space.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah, right. Yes. Yeah. We also have, on that point, have strict luggage rules. everybody has to pack a rolling carry-on, but the kids have to pack in one together. And they do not like that rule. This past summer, we agreed to two, that the three of them could pack in two

And they negotiated that. And the issue is not just the cost of luggage, The issue is actually rental cars. when we have a rental car, I got three kids in the backseat. I'm not doing a big third row SUV. That's much more expensive. And I can barely fit our luggage in a car. And I like to travel light. But so we do put some rules on them and they're like, they were giving me a hard time about it this past summer.

Suzy

That's true.

Maggie Tucker

And I said, cool, let me show you why and how much more it would cost if you wanna bring another bag. And then they're like, okay, I'm good. And they move on. I'm like, do you wanna pay for this? And as soon as I sort of put it on them, they get a little bit more reasonable in their demands.

always like, I only get four pairs of underwear. And I'm like, dude, there's a washing machine every single day. That's the other thing I love about Airbnbs. I can do laundry very easily.

Suzy

Yes, laundry is huge.

Because that was it the trip, your longer trip. I remember you shared about your ⁓ the lettuce.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah, I had a salad spinner. Yeah, I was using a salad spinner to like dry. I was hand washing like underwear and shirts and clothes. And then I bought a salad spinner at Aldi. It was much more efficient at drying than just wringing things out and drying them. And I still I have that salad spinner at my house now. We use it for salad now. The kids sometimes are like, that's disgusting. I'm like, I washed it really well.

Suzy

Yes, to close, sell it, it'll be fine. and I know you said you stayed at hotels a lot that summer because you still had your work benefit. you mind? Yes. Do you mind sharing what the budget was for that trip? I know you said you went to a couple different countries and Europe in the summer can definitely be on the higher end.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah, same thing.

Yeah, that's why I had a salad spinner, by the way, because of the hotels.

Yeah.

Yeah. We spent, I was trying to go back and find it and I couldn't find it perfectly, But I want to say that trip costs us about $20,000, 20 to 25, maybe. I can't really, I don't have like clean data on it, honestly. I once did,

We do not set a budget, We try to get a decent deal where we can. We try to use whatever points and miles we have available, and then we just wing it. there were some like excursions in Iceland that were crazy expensive, there were some where you go in caves and they were like, six, seven, $800 a person. And we were just like, yeah, the kids didn't even know that was a thing. while we don't have a budget, I think we are still very intentional about what we will choose to do and not to do.

Suzy

And having that conversation is really important to understand what is going to give us the most value as a family out of this trip for a cost that we feel comfortable with.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

Totally.

I'm always shocked. There was some stuff in Iceland where we asked, the kids if they wanted to do it. we'll test the waters by asking them. And as soon as I get a meh from them, I'm like, forget it. Let's just go for a hike.

versus like when we were in Australia, I said like, do you want to do snorkeling on the Great Barrier Reef? And they were like, my gosh, yes. And that was really expensive and it was super cool.

I wanna line up what I'm spending with what they actually care about. And I'm sometimes shocked by what they actually do and don't care about. So it's worth asking them.

Suzy

absolutely. Getting their buy-in is important because then if we're doing something that's low cost or free and it doesn't always go well, you're like, okay, no big deal. But if you put a lot of money into something that was maybe exciting for you, less for them, it is a trade-off, absolutely. And I do like that about travel sometimes is you're booking now for things later, so it does space it out. So then when you're on your trip,

Suzy

like spending money on food and things is like what you would do normally anyhow. So it does spread out the budget planning for travel because you get to plan ahead and there's the value of like, I get to go on this trip in a couple year, months or whatever the buildup is that, that is part of it love, yes.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah, that'sthe research is like, that's as much of the fun as like the buildup. And I noticed that with my kids even more, like they're just excited about like the prospect of going somewhere cool.

Suzy

And if we're going somewhere, I can find some YouTube videos or pull in books, or we can just talk about it a little bit more. What's the history? What's the culture there? They're actually more attuned to that. I'd love to hear either challenges or wins

from your experiences with traveling as a family.

Maggie Tucker

⁓ I'll be honest, we've been pretty lucky. We've not had a lot of challenges. I think the biggest issue we have is trying to pick a place to eat dinner that everybody's happy with. Often there's not one. It's like everybody wants something different those are nights sometimes where we'll just give up

Greg and I are vegan and sort of merging more towards vegetarian lately. But we often will go to like a vegan place I like supporting those restaurants when I'm out of the country too. And then we'll get like something different for the kids.

Sometimes the kids just don't appreciate a nice meal out. And after a long day of traveling, they just wanna like chill out. So we're like, we're gonna go out to eat and we'll be back in two hours, right? Which is really nice thing of traveling with older kids too. stay here, but call me if you need something.

Suzy

Yeah, but unlike the four year old, they'll actually listen and stay in their hotel room this time. I imagine that is kind of exciting to get into that phase of travel as well.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah. Yeah, they don't leave. Yeah.

It is nice to have a little alone time while you're traveling.

Suzy

Yes, yeah.

you do have a couple years until your kids are fully launched. But I'm curious what travel looks like after they're off doing their own thing. What might that look like for you?

Maggie Tucker

I have some like very specific visions of what that looks like for me. And the second, our youngest, which is the one I birthed goes to college. I want to go do some

real slow travel, right? Like I just want to like book a trip to Italy and if we like this town, stay there. the good thing is we'll be in like reverse travel.

we'll want to probably be home for the holidays when our kids are off on breaks from school and actually coming home. And we can travel during the off peak times when they're in school. we're just really excited about the idea of doing these like last minute trips and slower, longer trips.

and spending some time in a community. We've been to some places where we're like, I could come back here and stay for a month. And so we want to go back to some of those places And I'm excited at the prospect of traveling with my adult kids. I see people all the time traveling with their older kids.

I know that's one of the ways I will be able to buy their time. We've already discussed it with them. they like that we afford them that opportunity. when I even think about financial planning in the future,

I see people traveling with like their kid and their partner or their kid and their partners or their kid and their spouse or whatever. I have like a lot of visions for what that phase of life looks, it seems very far away still, but I know it'll be here before I realize it, so.

Suzy

Yes,I especially these like high school years go get busy and then boom, One of my favorite trips, like as a young adult was traveling with my family. I was living in California, but my mom got tickets to the world cup in Germany in 2006. So I flew over there, met up with them. we got to visit some family friends, see my family, And

Maggie Tucker

That's so cool.

Suzy

I don't exactly remember who paid for exactly what, but I remember feeling like it was a treat. It was fun to go. as I think about what our expenses are now, and we talk about like foreseeing into the retirement budget, I feel like my travel is a giant part of that because it won't just be us still, even if we can cut down the cost with the slow travel with.

Suzy

going off season, I think we could definitely offset it when it's just us two. But with the kids, I want to include that as well. So I always picture those people that like for their big milestone birthdays, like put on a trip or something for their grown kids and like have them all come. And I just think that would be a great way to to continue the traveling once people are all in their own stages and situations in life.

Maggie

you've seen all the stats about how much time you get with your kids when they're like in your household something like 95 % of the time you get with your kids is like before they're 18. our 17 year old, I rarely see her. She has an incredibly busy academic and social life. And when I when we even talked about this summer, we planned around her. She has like this crazy busy summer. And at one point I said, like, well, do you even have time to do this? And she's like, no, I really want to do it.

she's gotten the travel bug. she knows that we're her ticket to that, right? And so, and I think she enjoys the family time too, but it's hard to get them to prioritize that family time when they're teenagers, rightfully so, right? This is when they're figuring out their independence and everything else. And yeah, yes, that's a good way of saying it. It's developmentally appropriate. And, but the fact that, you know, if that's what it takes to get some quality time with my kids and that-

Suzy

Yeah, developmentally appropriate, but still.

Maggie Tucker

is kind of what it takes lately. I'm okay with that, right? That's the added benefit of like, I get to go explore a cool country and I get these just amazing core memories with my kids. And I didn't mention this,

It is like a whole different game going on vacation when being early retired. It is amazing. It was just different. It's just better.

Suzy

more time to prepare instead of feeling rushed packing the night before, more time to decompress after.

Maggie Tucker

Yes, yes.

you're on a two week vacation, it takes you a few days to even like decompress if you can at all. Then you get this like nice part in the middle and then you're like spending your last few days like dreading going back to the real world. And I'm like full in from the beginning to the end, right? I just get way more like bang for my buck on vacations and the just overall like engagement and presence with my kids and.

and Greg, my husband, when we're on those trips is like night and day.

Suzy

I love to hear that because you're right. The trips can feel so whirlwind if you're in the thick of it and you just go on this trip. I think it's interesting for families that are like, I really need a reset Maybe work has gotten too, too busy maybe they're not a hundred percent ready to fully retire, but even taking gap years or sabbaticals, just giving them the extra long time to really decompress so that there is a chunk of that travel that is

more high quality than it would have been otherwise those are good lessons learned and I'm glad you're sharing it now because it helps someone who's maybe in that situation of, okay, I can only get away for this long. How can I really make the best of it?

Maggie Tucker

I've heard of like a few progressive companies that require this. Like you are not allowed to engage while you're on vacation. Just turn it off. Your job will be there when you get back. You are legally allowed vacation.

So, I mean, my biggest advice would just be actually like protect that time and treat it like a true vacation and do not engage, You're convincing yourself that you need to, but you could set a boundary to say, am fully on vacation and I am here.

Just don't engage.

Suzy

Those are great tips. my husband grew up in Germany. His siblings still live in Germany. they get more vacation time. I'm always like, where is my sister-in-law? Where is she going? And they just did a long sabbatical last year to South America. I think he somewhat has that as part of just how he feels, even though in his company, he works remotely, but he has like a bit of a better balance.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

Yeah.

Suzy

And then my first professional job was one that was like, no, we own you 24 seven. Like you're on. We could call you up at any time. So I've carried that over into other jobs and I've really almost had to take a part time role in work.

in order to force those limits so that I also balance other things. These passion projects of mine that I'm finally doing and it's still hard. These things take time to transition when it's been part of your mindset, your work mindset for so long. you have a giant backlog of episodes that people should go listen to if they want to learn more about early retirement. But

if someone's like, okay, this is something I would like to do with teenagers, because I think there are benefits to traveling more with teenagers. Their kids are young now. How could someone financially prepare for more flexibility like you've achieved?

Maggie Tucker

more flexibility to have the time to travel.

Suzy

like more financial flexibility or flexibility with not having to work full time. I know early retirement doesn't happen overnight, but it can't happen over a couple of years of intentional planning and purpose. Where should they start?

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

I think the most kind of basic answer to that, because there's not like this, sexy get rich quick scheme. you kind of got to start where you are, right? So my husband and I were like higher earners. And so we could get to early retirement faster as a result. But we also, spent more than some families spend, right? And so

Suzy

Yes,

Maggie Tucker

It is all about how much you make versus how much you spend. then as you know, the equation of that is what you have left and how much you're able to save and invest. the biggest thing is just being very intentional about what your goals are and what you want to do. So if your goals are you want to spend more time traveling with you and your partner or yourself or you and your kids, then you understanding your why.

and putting that front and center and using that to then segue into more intentional spending. I don't want to think of it as deprivation, right? We have entire episodes and like you said, we've got between Friends on Fire and Inside Out Money, we've got like 350 or 330 episodes now. It's kind of crazy to think about. I've not missed a week of podcasting since January, 2022. Just crazy.

Suzy

That is amazing.

Maggie Tucker

But I think it's just thinking about what matters to you. I think it's discipline what are you willing to pull back on now so that you have more freedom and flexibility in the future? And the earlier and more you pull back on and can save, the earlier you can invest it, right? The magical growth of compound interest and growth.

will help that become more and more as you get older. I'm 45 now and I've still hopefully got many decades ahead of me. But once you get to the point where you've got a nice nest egg built up and you even just from a coast five perspective can see this, you eventually get to the point where you're just watching it grow, right? And it's beautiful. And then you have all this freedom and flexibility.

it's never too late, but also the earlier and younger you can do this stuff because you have more time for growth, the better. so many people are just like in a hamster wheel, mindlessly spending and just buying, buying, buying. And it's not making the many happier. And I think that is a just very important piece of it.

Suzy

such good points, Before we wrap up though, I'd love to just do a lightning round. ⁓ what is your favorite place, city or country?

Maggie Tucker

Honestly, this is like asking me my favorite child or something, right? I maybe sometimes go to like Ireland, but sometimes it's more just the memories I have, there was a town in Ireland called Greystone. it's like a coastal town in Ireland. And there's like a really cool

Suzy

Like, hahahaha.

⁓ I bet it's beautiful.

Maggie Tucker

vegan restaurant.

called by the happy pairs there. but I honestly like it's hard to name one place for me.

Suzy

Yeah, it is hard. What most unusual food that you've ever tried?

Maggie Tucker

I did spend like a couple months working in Shanghai, China before I had kids. And I know I ate some weird things there, like odd animal parts and stuff. I just can't remember them. And I have been vegan or vegetarian for the past 10 plus years. And so since then, I eat way less odd stuff when I travel because most of the odd stuff involves animal parts,

Suzy

I would love that you bring up that you are vegan because it's like sometimes people with certain dietary, you know, preferences or goals or restrictions are like,

it's hard to travel, but you're right. you can frequent restaurants that are vegan or vegetarian, lots of cities do have them. I feel like it's growing that there are

Maggie Tucker

It's actually easier.

You go to like London, Berlin, it's overwhelming where you're supposed to eat. When you're vegetarian, it limits the choices and you know they have to be good if they're still open. I find it actually easier to like choose where I wanna eat.

Suzy

yeah, it's endless.

That's yeah.

That helps with that decision fatigue. ⁓ One item that you cannot travel without.

Maggie Tucker

Yeah.

Chapstick and not the brand in particular, but you know, just some version of chapstick

Suzy

and bus, train or car.

Maggie Tucker

Definitely a train, get super car sick and I'm not a big fan of being in cars or buses for too long.

Suzy

First thing you do when you arrive in a new country.

Maggie Tucker

I just chug a ton of water because I usually have been in some way like not drinking as much water so I don't have to be that person getting up on the plane like six times.

Suzy

Catch up on that for sure. Early bird or night owl?

Maggie Tucker

We are like all major night owls. Luckily, my husband and children are all the same.

Suzy

That is good to be on the same page for sure.

Maggie Tucker

We will go, we went to like Iceland and I think we stayed on like Atlanta hours the whole time because we would sleep until 10 or 11.

Suzy

when you are traveling is there anything that you like to incorporate from like educational or learning aspect?

Maggie Tucker

we did a really cool Aboriginal tour in Australia, and just outdoorsy stuff, and learning about what is happening. Hiking and different things we're learning about nature are probably higher on our list.

Suzy

One piece of advice to a family that's just starting out with their travel journey.

Maggie Tucker

I would just say start where you are, right? And like, don't be afraid to try new things, We were talking about comparisons, the Thief of Joy, don't look at what someone else is doing, right? If you can't afford to go there yet, or you're not comfortable going there yet, like start with a smaller trip, less far away and like kind of build your sea legs don't be afraid.

but just like start where you are and build up from there.

Suzy

Absolutely.

And where can people connect with you if they want to learn more about your journey?

Maggie Tucker

you can find 130 plus episodes of Inside Out Money And the old Friends on Fire podcast is still around on all the podcast platforms. And I'm most active on Instagram. So if you want to reach out and say hi or engage in any way, I'm at Inside Out Money on Instagram.

Suzy

I want to say thank you for continuing with the podcast because I do like your new format, hearing different voices, people that are further along or just starting out. and the topics you cover are just so insightful. around the psychology and the thinking of money. thank you for continuing it. Yes.

Maggie Tucker

Aw, thanks. I appreciate it. Yeah, was when Mike wanted to retire, it was like very sad, I was, trying to think how to carry it on. So it's been fun to continue to do it. So thank you for continuing along and moving over to Inside Out Money.

Suzy

Awesome. Yeah.

Yeah, it's been great. Thank you so much. 

Maggie Tucker

thank you, Suzy.